Alex: Hello and welcome to this celebration of movie Excellence in 2024. I'm Alex Zane, and this is Countdown to the BAFTAs, where in this series we look back at five movies that were long listed along with the nominees for that most coveted award: Best Film at the EE BAFTA Film Awards 2024.
This time it's Maestro.
[START CLIP]
Lenny: Hello. I’m Lenny
Felicia: Hello, Felicia.
Lenny: Bernstein. Like that one.
[END CLIP]
Alex: In this wide ranging interview, we discuss how they got from the creative spark that started it all to the challenges faced in bringing it to the screen. And a quick warning, we will be talking about the story. So if you haven't yet, go see the movie, come back and get listening. This is Countdown to the BAFTAs.
Maestro is a towering and fearless love story chronicling the lifelong relationship between Leonard Bernstein, played by Bradley Cooper and Felicia Montealegra played by Carey Mulligan.
[START CLIP]
Felicia: If summer doesn’t sing in you, then nothing sings in you. And if nothing sings in you, then you can’t make music.
[END CLIP]
It's a love letter to life and art and at its core is an emotionally epic portrayal of a marriage Bradley Cooper, uh, writer, director,
Bradley: Bradley, writer, director, uh of the movie Maestro.
Alex: Bradley Cooper lovely to be able to talk to you about Maestro. Uh, first of all, let me say congratulations. how does it feel to have your film being recognized by BAFTA members?
Bradley: Oh, you know, it's incredible. I have to say. I've been lucky enough to be a part of films that have been recognized before. I think there's something about this one that, um, feels, uh, so vulnerable. That when, when there is recognition, it, I would be lying if I didn't say it feels really, um, supportive is the word, I guess. And, um, he's just sort of like, oh, okay. Okay. Does that make any sense?
Alex: It does. I, I, it, it, it does, um. I want to take you back to the start of, of this journey with Maestro then, if I may, to the very first time. The, the, the idea, the possibility of making this film presented itself to you.
Bradley: Yeah. Uh, the possibility presented itself through the, um, mythical figure of Steven Spielberg. Which is like the best way it could possibly happen where he, had the reins of this project.
And he was talking to me about potentially being a part of it as an actor. I was just finishing A Star is Born and I asked him to come see a cut of it and if he wasn't going to direct it. I thought that it could be something cause of my deep love for classical music and conducting since I was a kid, that it could be something that maybe if I felt like I could get a point of view on that I can maybe write and, uh, was excited to write it with Josh Singer if he wanted to stay on.
But it would be starting a new and creating a whole new thing and, and if he would be interested in that.
And then he said he was so. That's how that started. And then it just became, like most movies do where you have a, a topic and then you research it, or it's an idea and then you write it. And then we had to, you know, shop it around to all the studios. And then I learned that, you know, they had lost the rights to the music.
So we had, I had to go to the family members who, who control the rights and ask them if they would give the rights to us. You know, all of those things. So then it was really like starting at the beginning.
Alex: and I I'm right in thinking this, this script that you read, uh, initially, that, that, that sparked your interest in making the movie. The idea at that stage was very different. I mean, not that I'm saying there's any such thing as a standard biopic, but that's what this, this idea was. And that's something you didn't want…
Bradley: Well, but I will say this, Josh Singer wrote a script, uh, that I, the, the script, that I read was very unorthodox.
And and it was, it was really cool. I, I I don't know how to direct anything that I don't write or have co-write, so I knew that it was not something that I felt like I could be beneficial or additive to.
The only thing that was the, the linchpin was conducting.
Alex: Hmm.
Bradley: That actually it was that I've always had this deep like furnace of conducting that I always for some reason felt like, gosh, have I ever had the opportunity of, uh, doing something where conducting was involved.
Like in grad school we had to write a monologue and perform it. Ellen Burston came to our school and I, you know, I wrote a monologue about a conductor whose wife had just passed away, and it's this rehearsal, you know, so it was always there, you know, so that when. This thing came, I went, oh, well, you know, you sort of, I do believe in, there's sort of things that happen and if you listen to the signs and you try to do as much as you can to, to, um, to go after it.
So I was like, oh, conducting this is something I should really try to see how far we can ride this horse. So that's really what it was.
Alex: I mean, that's fascinating. I mean, it, it, it does feel like, uh, a certain amount of serendipity, uh, Spielberg showing you, uh, this script, you having this history with conducting, which I believe started in your, your childhood.
Bradley: Yeah. Like most people, you know, I've come to the, the great thing about being able to talk about a project, you know, in q and as is, you know, I'm definitely not alone. I think this was sort of common, place for children, you know, especially probably because of the same reasons for me that, you know.
Cartoons and Bugs Bunny and Tom Jerry, you know, them conducting and all of those cartoons back then were all to classical music. Most of them were set as a, as a, as the score.
So I'm certainly not some like, you know, I was conducting as a kid, you know, I think it's like most kids do that.
[Laughter]
Alex: I understand what you mean. Um, so when it came to, um, basically saying, look, I want to, I want take on Maestro, I want to go away, I wanna rewrite it with Josh Singer and, and come at it from a new angle. What was that angle? What did you feel like, like you had some skin in the game in terms of, this meant something to me.
I, I've added something and now this project becomes something I want to make. What was that thing? What did you see in this story that made you go, I've got something here.
Bradley: I mean, I think it started with we, I would never want to try to rewrite what he wrote, you know, so it was really, cause that, that's its own thing and it's a, it's a beautiful piece of work. This was like a separate, completely separate thing. So I just started from the ground zero, of starting to research.
I. Uh, and learn about Leonard Bernstein. And in learning about Leonard Bernstein and immersing myself into that world of classical music, the actual, uh, world, uh, going to, uh, various orchestras and, and them opening their, their doors to us, uh, it was just like, okay. You know, and even when I pitched it to the, to the children, I said, I don't know what it's gonna be yet, but I have a love and a, a work ethic.
So if you can trust me and let me show you A Star is Born, would you go on this journey with me? So it wasn't until the first quarter into researching just, just the topic that what seemed, um. Just unendingly fascinating is this relationship between Lenny and Felicia. I thought, oh, and I felt like that could be an anchor.
That's a story I think that would be worth telling and, and could be cinematically, um, appetizing and at the same time be a story that I could then weave in, all of his musical, contributions to us, um, the state of his life, publicly, privately what it is to be family. All of those things, because it would have to take place over decades because it's a movie about their relationship.
And I thought that we could really. By just focusing on this one thing, we could actually explore all of the areas I think, that are worthy of exploring. I. Just in different ways, you know, much more challenging ways for me, to do it, you know, sonically, uh, compositionally, rhythmically, you know, it all became very exciting. I thought oh…
And also I had to, you know, how can I possibly do the justice to this, this figure? Because he was so idiosyncratic. The movie itself I thought had to have the same…ambitious, um, nature and, and folly.
So I knew right away I thought, wow, this is gonna be very, very difficult and it's gonna take a lot of time, but if I just do one brick at a time, you know, I have a shot at maybe doing justice by the story. And that's really how it started. I realized how difficult I thought it was gonna be for me, but I thought this is the best way to tell this story.
Alex: And, and you mentioned, his children and I, I imagine when you decide, look, this is actually the story I want to tell with this movie about Leonard Bernstein's life with, uh, its marriage with, uh, Felicia Montealegre. Right? Did you then approach them with that idea? Did you have to seek their blessing?
Bradley: Yes. I said, yeah, very about a month into it. I said that, I said, I, I know what the movie's gonna be about. I said, it's gonna be about your parents and the movie itself, the rhythm of the film, the writing, everything is going to be one musical element. So I want to attempt a feeble attempt at a symphonic film, mimicking his rhythm to a story about his relationship with his wife.
And they were very, um…shocked that their mother was going to be, an equal member of this movie. And I think they were probably, um, apprehensive about the validity of such a statement, but while at the same time I'm being very excited that, wow, that would just be, you know, something that I think that would be really exciting for them, for their mother to be, uh, focused on.
Alex: So you've got this script that you've written with, with, uh, Josh Singer. You've got your vision for the film that, that you're directing. How easy was it to, to then find a, uh, a partner, a studio to back this, to go, to go in with you on Maestro? I mean, obviously at this stage you've directed and, and written A Star is Born. So was, was it an easy sell getting Maestro off the ground?
Bradley: So let's imagine you're a studio, right?
[Laughter]
I'm saying, okay.
Here's this movie. Okay? The movie is about a marriage. half of it's in black and white. I'm not gonna shoot it in a black and white film. And, uh, it's gonna be a 1:3:3 aspect ratio that very few movies are.
And, uh, there's gonna be a six minute scene where you're just gonna watch him conduct that, probably won't have a cut. And, uh, and it's about classical music in a marriage. Is that cool?
[Laughter]
And it's Leonard Bernstein. Who? Leonard Bernstein. Yeah, it did not go over well. So there were a lot of passes. There were a lot of passes. And then there was one meeting I had with Scott Stuber, uh, and he, and, and thank, thank the Lord. He said, uh, I trust you. I could tell how excited you are and I'm going to, I'm gonna bet, I'm gonna bet on it.
And I was like, ugh. Cause they, they were, if, if they said no, that was it. The movie would not have been made. Because the, because, uh, many, many people passed, many studios passed.
Alex: And I, and just so I can sort of almost, uh, live vicariously through your joy in that moment. Was that in the room? Did He, say yes in the room or did you walk out…
Bradley: Yes. He he said yes Yeah. He, he, he is the reason it got made, period. You know, and then, and, and, and he had put a lot on the line.
Everybody did it, that did this movie, you know, this was a movie that was made for love, uh, pure. It was like the love of the game. And, um, so everybody that got involved did it for that reason.
Alex: Well, I wanted to talk about your co-star, Carey Mulligan and how, how you've decided, first of all on her to play Felicia Montealegra and, and how early she signed on to this process.
Bradley: Yeah pre, script. As I was doing research, Carey kept coming into my head. I knew her for years, friendly, but never worked together. Uh, but every time I saw a photograph of Felicia or a video, I thought of Carey and then she happened to be doing a play in the West Village where, where I live, uh, in New York.
And I went to see it. Opening, uh, the first preview, which is sort of like sacrilege, you know, you're never supposed to do that, but I wanted to, I was so excited to see it. And she happened to have blonde hair at that time, and she came out, it was a one woman show and the key lights on her, and it was as if Felicia walked out.
And it was a very similar experience I had when I was at a cancer fundraiser and Lady Gaga was performing La Vie en Rose. And it was the same thing that happened where I was sitting there in the audience and I went, oh, that's Ally. Um, so, so I was very lucky that it was just so clear and concretized, at that moment.
And then I asked if I could meet her, uh, for, for coffee a couple days later. And I explained the whole thing to her. I played her make our garden, grow. Some clips of Lenny conducting, talked about what the movie's gonna be about, a marriage and one musical element. And she said, I'm in. And it was really beautiful.
It was really, I was very, um, beyond lucky.
Alex: Um, by all counts, um, she feels, uh, the same in terms of, I think I've heard her described this as not only one of, uh her favourite roles, but also in, in a good way, one of the most challenging and difficult roles she's ever played on screen.
Bradley: Great. Yeah, I mean, that's the hope that, that the hope is that you just keep, uh, growing and, and being, uh, afforded the ability to, to, to tackle roles that are gonna push us and then, and, and terrify us. And make us grow. So, I'm so happy that I was able to be a part of her arc as a, as an artist, at this moment in her, in her career.
Alex: Well, I think there's, there's, there's one shot not to jump too far ahead, but, uh, I think one of the, the moments that, uh, she's talked about is, uh, where you just hold the camera on her, where she's obviously been diagnosed with cancer, she's undergoing treatment and her friends come to visit.
But rather than have the camera visit them in that scene, it just holds on her the whole time.
[START CLIP]
Cynthia: Is there anything you need? Anything I can do?
[END CLIP]
Bradley: Yeah, that was a preordained shot. I always wanted it to be that way because my father died of lung cancer. Um, I basically wrote that section very similar to the way it went down with us.
[START CLIP]
Cynthia: And he makes his way up to the lectern, um
[Coughing]
Felicia: No, it’s fine. The... um... Lenny in the white suit.
Cynthia: Yes, yes, and he’s all in white
[END CLIP]
Bradley: And the thing that I would always, um. Shock me, I guess is the word, is, you know, you never sort of get over this.
What happens to, to somebody as they start to, um, suffer from this disease, you physically, everything, their spirit. And I wanted the audience to feel that same thing. Cause I kept thinking, I can't believe this is my dad who was like, you know, a gladiator and now look at him.
And I wanted the audience hopefully to have felt like they've gotten to know her. They saw her frolicking at Tango Wood and reciting that speech to Lenny at the, their first date and the, the house that they built in Fairfield and her strength and her and all of that. And then see that, and then have to be forced to sit down like her guests are.
And no, this is what's happened now. This is the, this is the result of this. Um, so it was always that, that, that was the intention of that scene.
I'm not allowing the audience to look away, and I knew that, um. She would deliver in ways that I would just be excited to watch, and that's what happened when we did that shot, which was a very long, dolly track shot, going closer and closer to her throughout the scene.
Alex: There's some very powerful filmmaking choices that you've made in this film. Um. Obviously before, uh, you made this, you have worked with, um, some incredible directors over time. Um, Guillermo Del Toro, uh, David O. Russell, Clint Eastwood.
Before we talk about you shooting this movie, did you at some stage feel that you were learning from these directors that you were working with before you came to direct yourself when you were on the set?
Bradley: Oh my gosh. Yeah. I mean, I've been learning since I was a kid watching television shows and then movies, and then working on Alias with JJ Abrams and Ken Oland and then Todd Phillips. I learned a tremendous amount. I didn't know anything. Check the gate, you know, Dolly Grip, you know, gaffer. I mean, I didn't even know the, the, the note, the verbiage.
And so I've been soaking it in for 20 some years. But clearly David O. Russell was the shift where, um, he, out of the kindness of his heart really, invited me to be a part of his process and taught me so many things by including me. I think directors have always found that, that, that hopefully that I'm an ally in the filmmaking and not just, uh, an ally to try to help my my role, you know, be, be, protected.
And I think that sort of love of filmmaking has seeped into the jobs I've done. And so I've been able to be a huge part of the, the, those, those films. Clint, um, invaluable. I learned so much from Clint. So much of the practical ways of shooting that I've adopted. Uh, and then Paul Thomas Anderson was like, you know, a masterclass in lenses really lenses I'd learned so much about just lens choice through him.
Uh, he allowed me to spend the three weeks of his prep with him before we shot, uh, Licorice Pizza. Who? Who? Oh, Guillermo. Oh my gosh. Guillermo. It was wonderful because Guillermo happened. Uh, while I had already written, Josh and I had already written a, a, at least one draft of the script, and I had started to, you know, a lot of it was in my head.
And then I went off and did Nightmare Alley. And, um, that was wonderful because just of his style, and the way he approaches filmmaking, his use of the techno crane for intimate scenes, all those things that I had not been exposed to before, that I then also adopted for, for the for Maestro.
So, yes, the answer, the long-winded answer, I apologize, is yes. Every single person I've worked with, I've been able to take something from. Ryuhei Kitamura who I did Midnight Meat Train with. I took stuff from, you know. I know you wanted to bring that, that movie up in case you for, in case you forgot it.
Alex: I, I, I was about to, you just got in there too
Bradley: Sorry. Sorry. I got too excited.
Alex: So you are, you took your time intentionally, uh, to prepare for making this movie. What effect did that have on the shoot itself?
Because of often no, no film, uh, shoot goes completely smoothly. But by all accounts, the amount of prep you did on this meant that the, the shooting of this was quite, uh, not quite, but a successful experience.
Bradley: Alex, you're, I mean, you, you're saying it's, it's exactly right. I've never had an easier time shooting a movie, which, if you had told me this five years ago, I would've thought, well, that's never gonna be the case. It's gonna be just a, a, you know, walking through mud because I'm there before crew call three to five and a half hours every day, you know, through the prosthetic work with Kazu.
But it wasn't, it was, it was the most effortless, easy time I've ever had. I have to say, because we were so, I was so prepared and I had spent so much time shooting test footage and so many things that it was also dialled in that it really could, it, it was just wonderful and I, I felt. Like, I was able to just listen and be open. And, uh, Lenny, I felt like I was Lenny, so that wasn't a question.
So hopefully I was creating an environment to invite everybody to come in and feel, feel that same sort of joy and relaxation. So that's something really potentially magical can happen and captured on film.
Alex: Well, I do, I do. I do wanna touch on, on, on the performance, uh, as, um, uh, Leonard Bernstein and briefly, purely because obviously you, you've played numerous roles over your career. You've got an extensive CV of, of various characters you've played. Was there something different about playing this character in particular?
I know you said you were quite daunted at the prospect of playing it, but when you're actually there as Leonard Bernstein onset, did it feel different to you as an actor?
Bradley: Yeah, it felt like I was use utilizing every single cell of my body.
In a way that I only had somehow felt that on when I did the stage play of John Merrick, Joseph Merrick for the Elephant Man, and, and Chris Kyle for Sniper. But even in those two, not, not to the extent of Lenny. Maybe because I was directing it also, but it just felt that it took every part of me to try to fulfil this character. Cause he was so many things, you know, he, he was so many things, he was so many hypocrisy, so much complications. So much joy. The other thing that's impossible to play or felt the most daunting was everybody said when he walked in a room, you know, he just changed the energy.
I'm like, how the heck do you do that? You know? That was something I was terrified. I knew I would just have to trust, just create the character and hope that happens. And every day felt like a magic trick. It really did. I didn't know, like every day I thought, I hope he comes in. I hope he comes in.
I knew that he was there, but I just wanted to make sure he was deciding to come in and, and, and be there.
So that's kind of thrilling, you know? Cause and that really takes you out of your head certainly of doing anything that, uh, is preordained in your head because the hope is that he's just gonna arrive.
Cause that's how it felt. It felt like he was. I know this is so wacky, but it did feel like that, it was like a ritual. Every day was like a ritual, like a séance in some weird way. And we were just hoping they'd come down. And also I had the huge benefit that Carrie Mulligan just was Felicia.
So all you pray for is the person you're acting with is talking to you and listening. And that's what it was all the time. I never felt like I was, she was saying a line that we had written ever. Not once.
Alex: I, I know part of that came from, um, your preparation together. You worked together extensively beforehand.
Bradley: Yes. That that prep. You know, Alejandro Iñárritu told me years ago, I was at a dinner party and he had, he said, “cabron, you're gonna direct?” And I was like, yeah. He goes, I have one word. Or I think I said, is there any advice is prep, prep, prep.
Alex: She, um, Carey has, um, has also said that, because you directed obviously in character as, as Leonard Bernstein as well, because you, you're on set performing and then you're also directing. And I know Carey said that really helped her, that that re that relaxed her. Uh, I guess there was never a moment where you were going to be able to break character direct and then return to character.
Bradley: Yeah, there was no break of character. It was just one thing.
And, and by the virtue of it being that's the best, easiest, uh, time saving way of doing it. And it's certainly from the acting standpoint, it's wonderful because you're always in it the entire time.
Alex: I, I do want to touch on, um. One of the, the most talked about scenes in the movie. And I, you, I'm sure you've talked about it a lot, but it probably because it, it deserves talking about this six minute, uh, single shot performance, the Ely Cathedral, uh, where you are conducting the London Symphony Orchestra.
Um, that's a, a huge undertaking. Uh, and I, I believe that scene was one of the, the scenes, like you said at this earlier on, that put studios off. But there it is. You got it made. Um.
How was that to shoot for, for you?
Bradley: Once we got there to that, once I landed on that composition, because I had, um. First set up many cameras the first day and I kept getting behind tempo and forgetting to cue orchestra members. And once that happened, and they're the London Symphony Orchestra, they're gonna do it anyway.
Cause we'd rehearsed with Janique to do the exact tempo interpretation of that 73 recording. Cause I wanted it to be Lenny's interpretation. Um, but then when I stepped on there to try to conduct it, I just kept messing up and I knew I was, and I thought, oh my, and it was terrifying.
[SNIPPET OF PERFOMANCE CLIP]
And I realized I, it's because I had. I had given myself so many get outta jail free cards, by the way I was shooting it and then that sort of made it so that there wasn't so much on the line. I was too protected. And I went back and I just took all that out and I just brought the techno crane in.
I said, what is the scene about? Cause that's the thing. Don't get caught up in shots. The scene is about her returning to him, and in the movie it's that idea of that she's gonna go, you know, that sweet child of mine that she says, um, that she misses right before that? And I was like, what, what's the next scene?
How did, what's the cinema of that to tell that story and this is it. Well, this means I'm really gonna have to not mess up. And so I just gave myself one more shot. And in that, that, that take, which is just one take of that setup that's in the movie. You know, again, as I said before, Lenny was kind enough to come down and do it.
My experience was I was just conducting the orchestra. That's how it felt. You know, there was no acting. And, and because of that, that's when surprises happen. Like, your mouth stays open for four minutes, you know, which I thought, well, I'm, I, we're, we're, we're gonna have to close my mouth through CGI or something.
This is crazy. But then I thought, no, this is, it's, and that's really what the movie, the feeling of the movie and why it feels so vulnerable. It's like. I dunno about you, but you know, you try to be cool or wear the right thing or, you know, hope somebody, and this is really, this is just like, this is me.
Like this is it. And um, people might laugh at me and hate it, but um, I'm just gonna put it out there and it's, you know. Yeah.
[SNIPPET OF ORCHESTRA PERFORMANCE]
Alex: And I, I obviously don't wanna dwell on, um, uh, on what sounds like a, a negative aspect to your, your first attempt at shooting the, the, the Ely Cathedral scene.
But how did it feel? I mean, you know when something isn't going right,
Bradley: Did you ever see that movie, the Money Pit with Tom Hanks?
Alex: I did
Bradley: Do you remember when he gets caught in the rug and it goes through the floor?
[Laughter]
That's, that's the image.
Alex: Yeah. Okay. That's all I need. I know how you felt in that moment.
[Laughter]
You've got the finished movie. just tell me, uh, when it comes to getting, uh, that final cut when you're, when you're in the edit, um, you know, we, we often hear a, a, a, a lot about, uh, certain movies. They, they go to test audiences, a test and test screenings and scores are given, and movies, sometimes a, a, a change based on that. Sometimes not. What was your process? Was that part of your…
Bradley: Yeah, we tested the movie three times.
It was exactly what we thought. Uh, you know, people liked it, other people didn't. It was very productive. But I would say that I've definitely worked with some movies where we really did make the movie in the editing room.
And this movie, just by the way, uh, we shot it, there was nothing to change other than having to reshoot the whole film because as you could tell, it's very, uh, it, it's, I always think about it as like Tetris. The joy of working with Michelle and Charlie and GA, the, the editorial staff that I loved so much, um, was really about, um, changing orders of scenes and stuff like that.
And Scott Stuber to his massive credit was always like, don't you want to like hear from Lenny? The beginning? Cause I always wanted to open it, uh, on that black and white and it was his suggestion. And then I thought, yeah, there, there's something there. And there was this interview with Mike Wallace that I loved and I, and I, that was inspiring where he talked about, this poem that he then made into Songfest Lenny.
And I was like, oh, there's something there. So then I, then I wrote that, and then we shot that. We actually, that was something that we shot after him playing the piano. The other thing I wanted to do, I had written this, we'd written this whole thing of, in Italy.
That I then, and then I and I scouted. And then as we were shooting the movie, I realized I didn't need any of it because we were getting everything within the, the, the fascia of the scenes themselves. So that was like three weeks. And I, and imagine telling a studio, you know what I, you know, we don't need to shoot in Sorento.
The crew was not happy. Um, so when that went away, the movie used to open, uh, in that place. So I knew that, that moment, that overture, Uh, that's not there. So it was just about sort, again, this idea of just being calm and knowing it's gonna happen And then, I never felt, um, other than that day in the money pit rug, um, felt that sort, that that thing of the walls closing in, you know, that sort of horrible feeling.
Alex: I will say, uh, just on the money pit hole, uh, that, that, that, uh, little tangent, I mean, that, that, that scene is, is incredible. Did the orchestra, uh, appreciate, because obviously they know they've been conducted..
Bradley: Yeah, the, the Tempus came up afterwards, came running from the back of the, the cathedral and was, and, and just said, you know, uh, you have to keep what you just did. You actually just conducted us. And I said, I, yes we will. He said, no, but yesterday you didn't. I said, no, no, I know, I know, but you did. It sucked.
And, uh, so he, he was a good sort of affirmation of like, what just happened?
Alex: Uh,
Bradley: It was pretty funny. I was like, oh, tell me what you think.
[Laughter]
Alex: Uh, you, you, you've finished filming, you've inhabited, uh, uh, Leonard Bernstein or, or he's inhabited you, however, however you wish to, to look at it for, for the duration of this movie. What's it like letting go of a character like that? Is, is it very much a, a switch? You can just switch it off and move on?
Bradley: Because it's such a physical change, right? And a and a verbal change that, that, that rhythm, like anything, like, you know, when you go to another country and you start to adopt the mannerisms, you don't even know it. It's sort of like that.
And so it took a while for it to come to, to leave more than anything. The rhythm with which he spoke, that melody that was so infectious to do. Uh, and I find myself even sometimes hearing the way I'm speaking and thinking like that is that, that sounds like Lenny.
Alex: I will say, and then this probably is, uh, is more about me and my, my potential la lack of knowledge about the music of, uh, Leonard Bernstein. But, uh, it's a really nice little moment at the end of your film where, uh, the credits come up and it says music, you know, the bit I'm talking about.
Bradley: of course. Yeah, I mean, the goal there, uh, uh, that's my favourite moment of the movie. Is when you see real Lenny conducting and then it ends with him, nodding to us. And it says, music by Leonard Bernstein. Because that was one of the major aspects of the structure of this film was in, in terms of veering away from the, the standard biopic structure where you would learn about all of his achievements.
I wanted the film itself musically to show us the impact of what he gave to us. And so I think a lot of people would not know that all this music that they've heard throughout the whole movie, uh, was his. 90% of it besides the two Mahler pieces.
So that was, that was, that's what that was about, is the hope is, oh my gosh. Like for many people, kind of, their breath gets taken away. Like, oh, that was his music. And they're also seeing him and hopefully feeling like they know him because they just watched this movie about him and not seeing this sort of Leonard Bernstein iconic figure that they've heard about.
Alex: So let me ask you about just how much responsibility, uh, you felt on this movie, because I, I, I think you've used the, the phrase before that you weren't really beholden, uh, to, to anyone else so much of this movie was, was, was yours and the responsibility, the buck stopped for one of a a, an age old adage with you.
Did that ever manifest, as pressure for you on this movie, or, or did you quite enjoy the experience?
Bradley: I think it manifested, uh, as pressure and prep. I think that's why it took so long, because, uh, you know, when you're playing a sport, uh, coaches often talk about, um, the fear of losing will drive you to win way more than wanting to win. And it's sort of the feel of the fear of disappointing the children, uh, his legacy, Carrie, the crew that I asked to come do this movie with me, Scott,
That that's a huge driving force. The, the, the fear of, of a, of a, of, uh, letting them down. Really, um, maybe that has something to do with being like a people pleaser. I don't know. But like, that definitely was a huge force. Just every day getting back up and, you know. Cause you don't see the end of the road for very long.
You know, the light at the end of the tunnel didn't come for a long time. And it really was just the love of the game and not wanting to disappoint people.
Alex: I think it's always a, a, a fascinating moment where a, a filmmaker gets to watch their film with an audience who is, there's no, no skin in the game. They, they, they're not invested in the film. This isn't a test audience. These aren't friends or family. This is people who are watching it cold for the first time.
Uh, where was that? What was the experience like and where was your, uh, mind, uh, just before the film started
Bradley: You know, it was interesting because I wasn't a part of that, because of, uh, the, the Guild was on strike. So it was a very unique situation where the movie premiered in Venice and then, uh, many other places it went to, and I was not a part of it. So for the first two or three months, I never saw the movie.
The first time I saw the movie. Spike Lee. I did one of his classes, but I wasn't there when the students saw it. Um, I, it was, it was at Geffen Hall. SAG had allowed me to come and just sit there with my daughter and my mom, so it was there. We had, we had done the New York Film Festival premier at Geffen Hall, which is where Lenny had conducted, I think 500 times or something, and we had outfitted it with to be Dolby Atmos and Dolby Vision, and that was pretty incredible to hear that music and that movie in the hall that he lived in and owned, uh, was very, very special.
But at the same time I am like, I always see the other thing is like, but then there's like somebody, you know, with a candy wrapper right behind me and you know, this is, you know what I mean? And the other person, did they just fall asleep? That literally, is that guy sleeping? You know? So there's that going on too, and thinking like, oh my gosh.
And I'm with my daughter. I'm like, oh my gosh, for two hours and 11 minutes, is she gonna be okay? And she was wonderful. She was right next to me because she's six, you know. And she's in it. She's actually young Jamie. That was the other reason why she came 'cause I was excited for her to
Alex: Oh, really? How did she, did she, what did she do when she saw herself?
Bradley: She loved it. Yeah, she was, she was great. Yeah. She, she we had so much fun. It was, it was wonderful. It was a really moment.
Alex: Brilliant. Um, right, a, a, a couple of, uh, very big quick fire questions, uh, to end our interview on. Uh, first of all, from your memory, what was your favourite day on the set or in the edit, during the making of Maestro?
Was there a particular day that you consider your favourite day in the process of creating this film?
Bradley: There's so many. I mean, what came to my mind was, um, I mean obviously that conducting day was really special. But the day when we did that slow push into her that you mentioned earlier in the interview. And I was just watching her, just this actor soar.
And that she does this moment where she, she touches her, um, scarf that she put to hide her, uh, that what the chemo had done to her, head and her hair, and you, and the, it's right when the woman's talking about how beautiful Felicia is, and you could tell that I this a moment of self-consciousness to make sure that it's covering everything that, that like floored me.
And that's the stuff you, you, you just pray for as a filmmaker. That the, that the actors are gonna be just delivering the most incredible moments.
Alex: Okay. Conversely, the flip side of that question, was there a particularly tough day? What was the most challenging day for you?
Bradley: I mean it was that first day. It was that first day with the a, a Neely. Yeah. That was horrendous. Yeah.
Alex: We, we don't need to revisit that. Uh. The toughest part, in your opinion of a producer's job. What would you say the toughest part of a producer's job is?
Bradley: Logistics. Logistically getting everybody scheduled together, the locations together and, and actually just get you to that first day of shooting is seemingly impossible. And then every day after that, and then the, and then getting it out there. I mean, it, it is an arduous journey for, as a producer, my gosh.
And I was lucky to be alongside Kristie Macosko Krieger was there every step of the way. And then we had other producers that were, that were wonderful too. Fred and Amy and Martin Scorsese and Steven.
Alex: Bradley Cooper, it's been an absolute pleasure talking to you about Maestro. I thank you for your time and once again, congratulations.
Bradley: Thanks, Alex. Thanks.
Alex: My thanks to Bradley Cooper and of course to you for listening. Follow the podcast to explore the rest of the nominees and much more in the months to come.
Thanks too to the producers of this series, Matt Hill and Ollie Piet at Rethink Audio with Sound design by Peregrine Pez Andrews. I'm Alex Zane.
This was a BAFTA production. I'll see you again as the countdown to the EE BAFTA Film Awards 2024 continues.
